Q24 ~ Why do you think Plato has Anytus appear at the end of Meno? How do Socrates’ actions in Meno shape our understanding of his philosophical defense in Apology?

24.  Why do you think Plato has Anytus appear at the end of Meno?  How do Socrates’ actions in Meno shape our understanding of his philosophical defense in Apology? 

RW: I’m really not sure about this one.  Content in previous outlines was OK (providing dramatic detail, etc.), but it isn’t clear what the thesis is supposed to be.  Thus, it’s hard to frame an answer.  This is my best shot.  I wouldn’t answer this question if it were offered!

I)     Intro

A)   Setup: Narrative settings in which Anytus appears

1)    End of Meno

2)    One of Socrates’ accusers in Apology

B)    Thesis: Anytus’ interaction with Socrates in the Meno provides a vivid example of the sort of Socratic dialogue Socrates defends in the Apology, and provides evidence that Socrates is not a sophist and doesn’t corrupt the youth.  [???]

C)    Map

1)    Socrates and Anytus in the Meno

2)    Socrates’ philosophical defense in the Apology

3)    Bringing it all together

II)   Socrates and Anytus in the Meno

A)   Anytus’ entrance

1)    He shows up as Socrates and Meno are about to discuss whether there are any teachers of virtue.   (Note: in Meno, virtue refers to character qualities required for management of household and city).

2)    Anytus is (supposedly) a good candidate for someone who would know whether there are any teachers of virtue and, if so, who they are, since he comes from a wealthy family, is well-respected (a politician), and is well-educated.  [Does Socrates really think this, or is he being ironic?  I lean toward the latter.]

B)    Anytus’ interaction with Socrates

1)    Socrates suggests that if you want to learn some craft, you find someone who practices the craft, professes to teach it, and makes his living teaching it.

2)    For virtue, Socrates suggests the sophists are such people.

(a)   Anytus has a negative view of the sophists: “they clearly cause the ruin and corruption of their followers” (91c).

(b)   He holds this view without ever having met a sophist (92b)

3)    Rejecting the sophists as teachers of virtue, Anytus proposes that any Athenian gentleman could teach virtue (92e).

(a)   Socrates runs through a list of men reputed to be virtuous who did not teach their sons to be virtuous (thus, they are counterexamples to Anytus’ claim).  Socrates concludes: “virtue can certainly not be taught” (94e).

(b)   Anytusʼ response: “I think, Socrates, that you easily speak ill of people. I would advise you, if you will listen to me, to be careful. Perhaps also in another city, and certainly here, it is easier to injure people than to benefit them. I think you know that yourself” (94e).

(i)    A clue that Socrates’ trial would happen?

(c)   It seems that Anytus thinks Socrates is slandering good men (including Anytus himself), though Socrates claims Anytus does not know what slander is.

III) Socrates’ Philosophical Defense in the Apology

A)   Socrates faces two groups of charges (old and new)

1)    Old charges (These have been around longer and are thus harder to dispel)

(a)   Socrates is a naturalist: He is concerned with things in the sky and below the earth

(i)    Socrates is actually concerned with morality and the improvement of his and others’ souls.

(b)   Socrates is a sophist: Making the worse argument the stronger and teaching others to do the same.

(i)    Socrates has never charged a fee, nor been anyoneʼs teacher.

2)    New charges

(a)   Socrates is impious.

(i)    Not significant for this question

(b)   Socrates corrupts the youth.

(i)    Anytus is among the new accusers (Meletus and Lycon are the others) and his suggestion/conviction that sophists ruin the youth links the old charge of sophistry to the new charge of youth-corruption (sophist à corrupting influence)

(ii)  Socrates confronts Meletus and shows that the charge is absurd.

(i)    Socrates gets Meletus to admit that he believes Socrates alone corrupts the youth.

(ii)  This contradicts Anytus in the Meno, where Anytus claims sophists (plural) corrupt the youth.

B)    Socrates explains his role in the city

1)    Testing the oracle: questioning the supposedly wise; angers those he questions.

2)    Gadfly (30e): He pushes people to examine themselves, so that they can become better, though it often angers people.

IV) How it all ties together

A)   In Meno, knowledge comes through reflection and recollection.  Our inquiry is a matter of self-examination (by which we recall what we have in our minds).

1)    Socrates’ interaction with Anytus in the Meno is one example of the way Socrates’ methods (i.e., gadfly, dialectic), which he defended in the Apology, encourage self-examination and can anger folks.

2)    According to the Meno, without self-examination we can be deceived (as the accusers are in the Apology; this is especially evident with the “Socrates is a naturalist” charge), and our deception can lead to doing unjust things (e.g., killing Socrates).

B)    The fact that Socrates seeks understanding of virtue in Meno lends credence to his claim in Apology that he does not seek the corruption of the youth.